is this normal?

[donpool]

I bought this hatchling (possible) Enigma, it hatched last Jan.21, 2014. since last night, she doesn't move much and her tail's raised high like a scorpion... when she hears a sound she twitches but she only stays in place...when i got her two days ago, she already had her first shed. this is her pic from today:

 

[tb144050]

Does she eat, poop, or anything? With her being less than 2 weeks old, I don't know anything but more info will help others with experience.

 

[donpool]

she made this tiny green poop and ate her shed...i removed other shed laying on the hide since molds are starting to grow from it..

 

[tb144050]

what about her eating? what and how have you tried feeding her or enticing her to try to eat? what are the details of her cage/habitat setup, etc? This topic might be best asked in the "Health & medications" area, and there is a questionaire posted at the top of that area that you should fill out.

 

[donpool]

About yourleo:
- incubated as male
- hatched last Jan 21, 2014
- got him last Jan27, 2014
- got him from abreeder

A) Health/History
I bought thishatchling (possible) Enigma, it hatched last Jan.21, 2014. since last night, hedoesn't move much and his tail's raised high like a scorpion... when he hears asound, he twitches but he only stays in place...when i got him, he already hadhis first shed. this is his pic from last night:

B) Fecals
Last poop I foundwas on the 27th

C) Problem
She doesn’t movemuch. She also ignores the mealies in her bin

Housing:
A) Enclosure
- plastic tub
- paper and papertowel
- a moist hide
B) Heating
Temperature is at86F to 88F

 

[acpart]

I'm not sure about the health of your gecko, though the posture and your description look worrisome to me.
In general, though, I don't think it's a good idea to buy a gecko that young. I don't sell mine until they are about 15 grams and I'm sure they are eating well. I'd recommend you bring this gecko back to the breeder if possible.

Aliza

 

[donpool]

The breeder just told me that it may just be off feed. But i think this might be the syndrome... any advice how i could make him eat?

 

[tb144050]

I'm not sure about the health of your gecko, though the posture and your description look worrisome to me.
In general, though, I don't think it's a good idea to buy a gecko that young. I don't sell mine until they are about 15 grams and I'm sure they are eating well. I'd recommend you bring this gecko back to the breeder if possible.

Aliza

^^ +1. I had all these thoughts, but I wasn't entirely sure about saying it unwise to buy that young...I know it's unwise to ship that young, but wasn't sure about it being risky to buy from a local show...


Can you post a pic of her belly? Perhaps someone can look at the pic and tell if it was premature?

As for my amateur suspision: I wonder if this leo was born slightly premature and perhaps its inner-organs are not quite developed??? It would naturally be weak because it isn't eating and isn't eating because of "tummy troubles". I have no experience with the "syndrome" but from the few posts I have read, those geckos (in the posts) were active but very clumsy and (sorry to be so blunt) Darwin's theory would not let them survive longterm.

(Again...this above is an amateur theory^^^)
--------------------------------------------------------

Now trying to be productive......a few more theories:

1) Bumping the warmside temp up to 91F may help in digesting food, creating energy and getting nutrients for development... In my few months of experience, the Leo is usually more interested in food after this has started.

but

2) lowering the temp down to lower 80's should slow the metabolism and require less nutrients while the leo adjusts to it's new home (or possibly finishes developing its inside organs??)

Definitely:

3) Try the "slurry" that is recommended in the "health & medications" section to provide nutrients that will build energy and stimulate appetite. This can be dripped onto her mouth so she licks it off (and ingests it) without having to hunt or move.

-----------------------------------------------

I wish I had more advice. Hopefully someone can tell you which path is best.

 

[tb144050]

I bought this hatchling (possible) Enigma, it hatched last Jan.21, 2014. since last night, she doesn't move much and her tail's raised high like a scorpion... when she hears a sound she twitches but she only stays in place...when i got her two days ago, she already had her first shed. this is her pic from today:

View attachment 62598 View attachment 62599

I can't stop looking at the photos. That poor baby is 9 days old and it is just bones.. I don't know if it ever ate. If I understand it correctly, you bought it when it was only 6 or, at most, 7 days old... I have seen pics of other hatchlings and they are usually plumper than that on Day 1. Then they started eating like pigs by Day 3...

I think she was premature, or never started eating, or both...(amateur diagnosis based on age & appearance).

 

[donpool]

thanks
here is the pic of his tummy.
as for your suggestion of bumping up temp, where should I place him (especially since he doesn't seem to want to move)



i'll try prepping up a slurry to feed him tonight also. Thank you so much, i'm getting very worried for this dude.

 

[donpool]

also this is his video earlier today:
[video=youtube;5kQaGDDum2M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kQaGDDum2M[/video]

 

[leopard love]

Poor baby I would take him back to the breeder or do what u can to nurture him/her to the fullest poor thing

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk

 

[tb144050]

thanks
here is the pic of his tummy.
as for your suggestion of bumping up temp, where should I place him (especially since he doesn't seem to want to move)

View attachment 62638

i'll try prepping up a slurry to feed him tonight also. Thank you so much, i'm getting very worried for this dude.

:'''(

Does he EVER step, move its head side-to-side, or ANYTHING beside the head-raise and tail raise twitches. I am no expert but there are things I see that just don't look right:

1) The "stiff look" in this photo...looks like a medical condition. poor circulation? no neurological control? i don't know...

2) The organ in center-belly is normally dark, but the esophogus from throat to belly is not black on my geckos...that doesn't look good.

3) In the video, I am seriously wondering if he can move his legs at all... This extreme case of physical disability may be a severe case of "enigma syndrome"?

4) In the video, it looks like the excessive twitching is a seizure...probably caused by the stimulation of movement around him. The increase in "blood pressure" may be causing pain?

------------------------------------------------------

I would be returning him to the breeder so the breeder can pay for vet bills for the care or euthenasia. :''''( Again, I say that gecko is so skinny that I doubt it EVER ate. The stomach-"area" looks closed so I think it wasnt absolutely premature (??) so maybe this is an extreme case of "enigma syndrome."

If the breeder won't take him back, I would try to place him on a floor-spot that is precisely 90-F, and drip slurry onto the side of his mouth (if he can use his tounge to lick it in), and hope....

 

[donpool]

:'''(

Does he EVER step, move its head side-to-side, or ANYTHING beside the head-raise and tail raise twitches. I am no expert but there are things I see that just don't look right:

1) The "stiff look" in this photo...looks like a medical condition. poor circulation? no neurological control? i don't know...

2) The organ in center-belly is normally dark, but the esophogus from throat to belly is not black on my geckos...that doesn't look good.

3) In the video, I am seriously wondering if he can move his legs at all... This extreme case of physical disability may be a severe case of "enigma syndrome"?

4) In the video, it looks like the excessive twitching is a seizure...probably caused by the stimulation of movement around him. The increase in "blood pressure" may be causing pain?

------------------------------------------------------

I would be returning him to the breeder so the breeder can pay for vet bills for the care or euthenasia. :''''( Again, I say that gecko is so skinny that I doubt it EVER ate. The stomach-"area" looks closed so I think it wasnt absolutely premature (??) so maybe this is an extreme case of "enigma syndrome."

If the breeder won't take him back, I would try to place him on a floor-spot that is precisely 90-F, and drip slurry onto the side of his mouth (if he can use his tounge to lick it in), and hope....

i've seen him step and was quite active when the breeder handed him to me. he also made a few steps during his first night here at home. that was the last i've seen him walk since i got him. The breeder won't seem to take him back. What does a floor-spot mean?

 

[tb144050]

....just a spot on the floor over the UTH (warmspot)

 

[tb144050]

Also, I just noticed the specific detail: In the pic of him on his back, he is still frozen in the EXACT same pose as when standing? (legs in same position, same exact curve of spine/body/tail). This would suggest a problem with the nervous system: constant tension of muscles, as opposed to lack of control. A lack of control would cause limpness, but he is at FULL tension and all muscles are locked into place??

It makes me think of rigor mortis, as if his body has died but his brain can still barely function the head & tail...I don't think this is possible, so I am still leaning towards his nervous system being "shorted out" and all the body muscles being "totally tense."

I would imagine if he feels anything, it is probably a severe total body PERMANENT cramp (aka "charlie horse" in some US slang) from this "nervous system shortout".

I think a visit to the vet will end his suffering.

I posted a thread in "Health & medications" asking for anyone to come see this link and give advice. I am just an amateur with a "knack" for logic & theories."

 

[donpool]

Thanks! i tried dripping some slurry to his nose but even his twitching is of low energy.

 

[Figtoria]

I would be super worried about the fact that he's willing to be laid on his back like that.



I hope he's okay.

 

[tb144050]

Thanks! i tried dripping some slurry to his nose but even his twitching is of low energy.

does he lick at all?

 

[acpart]

The breeder just told me that it may just be off feed. But i think this might be the syndrome... any advice how i could make him eat?

Just for information: there is no way a 5 day old gecko can be considered to be "off feed" since it's way too early for the gecko to start eating reliably.

If you decide to get another gecko, please don't get one that's younger than 4-6 weeks or much smaller than 15 grams.

Aliza