hatched with no eyelids...

[KaprikaAZ]

i just had a baby hatch..perfectly healthy looking otherwise but....its missing eyelids..
this is the first time its happened, and..i dont want to kill it, i really dont. ive googled it, and theres not much say on what to do if this happens

can i raise it anyhow?
would it suffer?
do i..have to kill it..
and if so, whats the..most humane way

 

[stager]

Are you sure he has no eyelids can you post a photo

 

[KaprikaAZ]

i cant. my camera wont focus on such a small thing. the photos are too blurry when i get up close.
but he doesnt have any real top lids. on one side he can kinda half close em like, he sinks his eyes in and it gets some coverage but otherwise his eyes are just sorta wide open

 

[tb144050]

Take a focus photo from a distance, then use ms paint to crop just his head into a photo by itself.

 

[KaprikaAZ]

here..they still arent all that clear, but its the best i could get. im also tryin not to have him scury around alot. hes still got some yolksac on his bely

 

[tb144050]

Oh my ....looks sad on my phone. Id say to black out his tub completely, but i dont think thatll solve the problem of drying out

Is that much yolk normal? (im new to this)

 

[tb144050]

It might cause skin problems later but a mister or higher humidity might be needed???

 

[stager]

You can black it out I am no vet but I think his eyes will eventually become infected and go blind. Is this the first hatchling from this pair? And was it premature?

 

[acpart]

I have hatched geckos with notched eyelids that don't close well, but not with no eyelids. For the ones with notched eyelids, I dip my (clean) finger in some (clean) water and put the drop on each eye. I do this several times a day. I have found that at least for the ones with deformed eyelids, as they grow they seem to develop a better ability to close their eyes, are able to see and ultimately to feed themselves. It may be worth doing this for awhile to see how it does because I thnk it's hard to gell on a gecko so small whether it has eyelids or not. If you do need to put it down and can't/don't want to do it yourself, bring it to a vet (my brother is a vet and does this for me). You may have to pay something, but it's worth not having to do it yourself.

Aliza

 

[KaprikaAZ]

i really cant bring myself to kill it just yet, i want to at least TRY to save it. ill try the eyedrop thing like you said, and keep it in a fully dark drawer with humidity and see if it doesnt further develop some lids. if not....then ill do what has to be done..

...if that happens..what is the most humane way to..do it?

 

[tb144050]

...if that happens..what is the most humane way to..do it?

She said it above...vet.

If you consider "home remedies", I have spent the hours researching/comparing "home remedies", and they all suck. Most of them have been declared inhumane because of suffering, such as a gecko feeling itself freeze to ice because it's still alive.

If you have to do it, be sure it is somehow "absolute". Anything that leaves the brain intact will cause suffering because Leo's use so little oxygen that sometimes they (theoretically) are brain-active for hours(??) even after getting "decombobulated."

 

[tb144050]

Was it premature?

And maybe it will learn to adapt? Grow a longer tounge or move its cheek muscle up to meet the upper-head in the middle of the eye?

 

[KaprikaAZ]

well the clutchmate was born. and its got partial eyelids at least..thank god. that one is spunky and screamy so i think that one will be okay.

as for the vet, my huband is in the process of changing jobs and i dont want any "unecissary" purchashes right now. if i can do it at home i will. i just want to do it in the least painful way for it as i possibly can.

 

[tb144050]

well the clutchmate was born. and its got partial eyelids at least..thank god. that one is spunky and screamy so i think that one will be okay.

as for the vet, my huband is in the process of changing jobs and i dont want any "unecissary" purchashes right now. if i can do it at home i will. i just want to do it in the least painful way for it as i possibly can.

Many people will ask you what they asked me when i first asked "how to humanely......at home?":

Why intentially breed if you cant afford vet visits for necessary stuff. I never found a tried and true "at home" method, and i really tried. But if you want to ensure as little suffering as possible, it will be messy. You cant leave the brain intact. I have an idea that should cease brain function instantly, but i dont want to post it online bc it is graphic. Pm me if you intend to do it at home so i can offer a possible method that should end it instantly(??).

 

[KaprikaAZ]

well obviously my husband wasnt in between work when i STARTED months ago. this wasnt a planned financial low point, life happens. the new job is better, theres just a span of time when the paychecks dont overlap because of the transition, and a wee bit of catchup time. but yeah, ill PM you

 

[tb144050]

well obviously my husband wasnt in between work when i STARTED months ago. this wasnt a planned financial low point, life happens. the new job is better, theres just a span of time when the paychecks dont overlap because of the transition, and a wee bit of catchup time. but yeah, ill PM you

I did not mean to offend.. As I stated....I just wanted you to be ready for that line of questioning. :O

I responded to your PM. From all my reading, each popular method of "at home" euthenasia involves moderate to severe suffering, but most humans don't see it or just sleep better at night because they don't have to watch it.

I did a google-search for "leopard gecko humane euthenasia" and read MANY battles, and alot of the documented scientific studies about how long it takes for them to cease brain function even while their blood/skin/eyes turn to ice-cicles, or they spend hours suffocating (or even decapitation) from lack of Oxygen (because of low metabolism or something??), etc etc...

If you have to do it yourself, alot of people respect "brain scrambling" or whatever it's called to quickly cease the long suffering....I have read it is hard and greusome for an amateur to successfully do, so the amateur just caused horrible pain.

Check my PM response for a suggestion I thought of...greusome but effective at ceasing brain function.

 

[KaprikaAZ]

its ok, i just find that in the Herp community lots of people are REALLY fast to jump on other keepers and go straight for the "moral" jugular. and are super fast to scold others for being "unprepared" or "uneducated" or things of the like. like, i get the whole responsibility thing? but i never see anyone get as up in arms and venemous over like..dogs or birds or cats. if you got a reptile and you encounter a problem?? your a HORRIBLE MONSTER of a person that should have already known EVERY FEASIBLE THING about that reptile before buying and have been a complete expert. ive got herp books layin all over my house, and this was never a subject that came up.

*shrugs*

there are people that are genuinely ignorant and buy a reptile on a impulsive whim and dont do any reasearch beforehand and just assume it will be like taking care of a fish or something, and those people really SHOULD have been more responsible, but i feel like the herp community has developed an extremely HIGH sensitivity to the subject, and attack at the slightest show of lacking knowledge.
if someone is asking a question, they shouldnt be scolded. if they are asking they are wanting to learn, and they should be rewarded not belittled.
EVERYTHING has a learning curve. nobody can truely be a expert on something without ever having gotten their hands into it and done some hands on education.


sorry for the rant, ive had many experiences where other herp owners ganged up on me for crud out of my control. and would tear me to peices merely for the fact that i either asked a question, or even just stated that i had something bad happen.

 

[KaprikaAZ]

the first of the two babies died today..it had its first shed, and its belly wasnt tottaly "closed" and it ended up pulling it open, and....well insides became outsides..
the other baby isnt "pretty" looking persay, but hes doin pretty well, and he can manage a squinty kinda blink with his partial lids.

at least one looks like hes gonna make it

 

[Dinosaur!]

thats terrible, and i am sorry for your loss . Was there by chance a power fluxuation that could have altered the temps in the incubator that you know about? even for a short time? a dramatic temperature flux has been proven to cause premature hatching and/or deformities in hatchlings, and may i ask what kind of incubator you use?

 

[acpart]

Sorry for your loss, but at least the decision was taken out of your hands. Try the water droplets on the eyes with the one you still have. ALthough temp fluctuations can be the cause of deformities, I think there can be a problems sometimes with the breeders as well. I have a snow blizzard that produced healthy viable babies for one season and then for the next 2 seasons produced very few live offspring and every one of them had a mild deformity. These eggs were in the same incubator with other geckos' eggs that produced healthy hatchlings. This female is now on sale as a "pet only". ALso, by the way, when the belly doesn't close it's called an abdominal hernia. I've had 2 of those in the past 9 years and both babies died.

Aliza